Welcome to the Q&A of Season Six, Episode Three “Oathbreaker” of GAME of THRONES, I hope you enjoyed all the work we did getting you Primed and ready for Sunday Night.
As always Earl and David have not read the books, but David has seen all the Blu-Ray extras, and since we have out-paced most of the book story-lines, we have added a third person to the roster, so please welcome Shauna to the Questionnaire! or should we call this our Game of Thrones Roundtable? Shauna has read the books, but promises to keep her fancy book-learnin to a minimum. Please join us Tuesdays after the show to get our thoughts on the show.
Sorry for the day’s delay, I had to skin a boar.
Earl: There are a few Oathbreakers in this episode. You have Daenerys breaking her bond to Dothraki tradition by leaving Vaes Dothrak and entering the world after the death of Khal Drogo. Not entering the Dosh Khaleen, the group of widowed Khals, immediately after the death of Drogo was a serious offense.
You also have House Karstark who broke their oath to House Stark as the true rulers of the North, and now you have House Umber who have handed over Rickon Stark over to a usurper in Ramsey Bolton. All three houses have broken their oath to House Stark who are the traditional Lords of the North.
However, the main Oathbreaker that everyone will focus on in this episode is Jon Snow. Jon has been brought back to life, and in killing his betrayers in the Nights Watch he has committed his final act. Now, by being killed it effectively ended his commitment to the Watch, and by being resurrected he can say without impunity that his Watch has ended.
Shauna: There are quite a bit of Oathbreakers in this episode. The first that comes to mind of course is Jon Snow. With his death, the shackles of his Night’s Watch oath goes away, which seems like a good thing, but Jon is so confused as to why he is alive, that it doesn’t even matter that he has slipped through this loophole.
I digress a little to say that I disagree with Earl in labeling Daenerys an Oathbreaker. I wouldn’t consider her one at all; the Dothraki women are born into this culture and they know their places quite well: first as a thing of desire for me, then a wife and at last, if they are lucky, a widow. Dany, an outsider, only learns of culture and tradition as it applies to her. She could not foresee Drogo’s death and therefore how would she know of the Dosh Khaleen? It’s a bit unfair to say that she broke an oath she had no idea existed in the first place.
Another Oathbreaker and an awful one at that is Smalljon Umber. What a bastard! The Umbers were sworn to be loyal to the Starks and I see this as another power grab for the disgruntled sons of these former loyal houses. I hope Osha opens one of those bastards up from nose to tail.
David: Well, I can’t see Jon Snow as the Oathbreaker, since being dead, he’s released from his vows. In addition to those listed above, let me add Samwell Tarley to the list. He promised to keep Gilly close to him and keep her safe, but now he is going to drop her off on his family? Thats going to be a jolt for all concerned.
Earl: We came so close to finding out if R plus L truly equaled J. Ned Stark, Howland Reed, and a few others dueled with the Kingsguard that was protecting the Tower of Joy. Even though Robert’s Rebellion was over and the Mad King as well as his son Rhaegar was dead, the battle to protect whatever was hiding in that terror was intense. It was a well shot sequence, and now we find out the real conclusion to it. Ned did not defeat Ser Arthur Dayne single handedly. No. It took a stab in the back from Reed, and since stabs in the back are not seen as honorable, it had to be omitted in the story that Ned told Bran over and over again.
So, we still do not know if Lyanna and Rhaegar are the parents of Jon Snow but I feel we are only an episode or two away from confirming it, and Bran Stark is closer to finding out the complete origin story of his family.
Shauna: History is written by the winners, and the winners say that Ned Stark bested Arthur Dayne in this meeting. Of course we see now that it wasn’t true at all and Ser Dayne was brought to his end in quite a dishonorable way, stabbed in the back (a common theme in GoT). This is a huge deal, Ned Stark is not as pristine as we thought he was. This opens him up to so much doubt, what was in the tower that Ned Stark chose to be dishonest? Something to think about…
Interesting to note, Ser Dayne makes a point to say that if they were at the Trident with Rhaegar, it would be Robert would be at the bottom of the river. What was so important at the Tower that was worth more than the Prince’s life that he put his two best Kingsguards there and not with him?
David: That book readers can still be smug?
Well, it’s going to finally get to the R+L=J that the book people keep going on and on about. It should be fun, and with the person the right hand side of the equals sign back into the game in a big way, could be fun. I’m all for flashbacks. I also liked that they waited a bit before we found out it was a flashback. I was wondering WTF with the Three-Headed dragon on the armor of the two guys. It was enjoyable. I don’t really have a problem with Ned not telling his boys he had to get help to beat a guy. No dad wants to tell his boys that he was getting whupped. My question- where was ICE? I can understand that a dual-wielder vs a guy with a two-handed broadsword would mean we don’t have any Stark boys in the series, but it would have been fun to see him go get it from his horse to lop off a head or two.
Also, why did they have Neil Patrick Harris play Ned Stark?
Earl: This week it felt like Cersei and Jamie were one step closer to being the people that they were in Season One. Cersei especially seemed to be moving back to the vengeful queen that thinks she’s smarter than she really is. However, unlike Season One where she seemed to move with little checks and balances, this time she has a strong small council in the place of her uncle Kevan Lannister as Hand of the King, and Lady Olenna Tyrell calling the shots. She cannot bully them but she has Jamie fully on her side, she has the Mountain, and Qyburn who will be filling the role of Lord Varys as the Master of Spies.
Jamie’s role in the past was to effectively limit Cersei but with Myrcella’s death, and the Faith running King’s Landing I think he’s on board with whatever Cersei wants at the moment.
Shauna: Cersei and Jaime were beginning to show slivers of their old Season 1 selves. Cersei, in fine form, trying to grab and consolidate power wherever she can and now with the full support of Jaime and Ser Gregor Clegane. Book fact: when Qyburn reanimates him, they refer to him as Ser Robert Strong. I have thoughts on why they keep reminding us that he is Gregor Clegane but I leave that for another post.
David: Cersei is doubling down on her role as Queen-Bee, but the problem is, she doesn’t have the legitimacy or the power to do what she wants. She has traded up from Pycelle to Qyburn, but I’m not sure a leaner force is going to turn out well for her. Jamie really didn’t do much. This upcoming week should be fun, and I can’t wait to see what could happen if the Queen of Thorns and Cersei get together.
Earl: I can be wrong but watching the scene of Jon walking away of Castle Black, I heard Maester Aemon’s words of kill the boy and let the man be born echo in my head. Jon leaving the Night’s Watch can be the first step to House Stark taking back Winterfell. He can be part of a much larger story line but he can’t do it at the Wall, and he can’t do it by simply being Jon Snow. He might not understand why he’s resurrected, and he may have lost a part of himself, but to simply leave the Watch after getting his revenge cannot possibly be enough for him.
Is he gone for good? He better be. If he’s not a part of some revenge tour meant to bring the North back under the Stark banner then there is no real reason to bring him back. Jon Snow better be out for blood. The more blood the better.
Shauna: Jon is suffering from what I will call Buffy Syndrome (another favorite show of mine). Like Jon, she was resurrected from the dead through magic and had a difficult time processing why she was brought back. With Jon having vivid recollection of his murder, it is understandable that he would be in a complete brain cloud as to why he is walking around with a collection of stab wounds in his gut and not a burned body.
I think back to a conversation between Aemon Targaryen and Jon when Aemon tells him to “kill the boy and let the man live”, children have their innocence to guide and protect them, if a child thinks something is right, it just is. Only when they grow up do they understand that it is not just simply right and wrong that comes into play. I think Jon dying and coming back aids in his transition from boy to man, only adults can truly understand failure and the gravity of consequence and he’s feeling that now. He knows now that he has to chose what to do with this second chance and leaving the Night’s Watch and Castle Black allows him to figure that out.
David: Jon has been trying to do the right thing, and he has been trying his best against unprecedented problems.
I don’t think he’s gone for good from the Wall, but I do think he’s gone from the Lord Commander’s spot on the Wall. I think Jon is going to take the Wildlings, Ser Davos and the only remaining Hot Redhead at the Wall back to Winterfell and take some names as there is no chewing gum at the Wall.
Earl: The easy answer is to say that Ramsey will torture them. He likely will torture them, but there is value in keeping Rickon alive. As far as Ramsey knows, Rickon is the legitimate heir to the North. Robb is dead, and no one knows where Bran is. Since there is Salic Law in the world of Game of Thrones, Sansa and Arya would be excluded from becoming the Lord of Winterfell so House Umber just dropped a huge chip in Ramsey’s lap. With Rickon, he will likely draw Sansa out of hiding and he may very well get Jon’s attention as well.
The seeds for war in the North has been planted. House Bolton, with House Karstark and House Umber have clearly signaled their intent to claim their legitimacy by force.
Shauna: I hope that he begins to see some of what Roose was telling about consolidating and keeping a hold on the North and maybe Rickon will help him do that. Knowing Ramsey as we do, we can expect that at some point, harm with come to Rickon at his hands. I truly hope that Jon gets to him first before that happens.
My week’s post is dedicated to the beloved and stupidly name Shaggydog.
David: Osha is most likely dead, as she has no name to make Ramsey keep her, and Rickon only has a name, that Ramsey doesn’t need. If Roose was alive, Rickon might have a chance to survive with all his parts. What should Ramsey do? Put Osha in the kitchens, and Rickon to the sword. Alive, he’s a rallying point. Dead, only Bran remains as a male Stark.
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