NBA Roundtable: Dec 11th

You want me to go where?

Welcome to the NBA Roundtable!

This week, I thought I would take a different tack, and play around on the NBA trade Machine. I was talking with a guy in my training class at my new job, (shoutout to Shep) and trades for the Lakers came up.

So I hit the NTM, and here we go, If you are not a Lakers Fan, skip to trade 5.

This week we have the full crew, with Joao Pedro, Dan Vachalek, and the J Brothers in full effect.

1. Take a look at this trade:

Amare for Pau Gasol- Straight up

You want me to go where?

Trade works
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7vh24p8

Thoughts?

DJ: DJ: Hell no. Sure, he may have played in Mike’s system, but he isn’t a very good outside shooter and that is what I think the Lakers need. A “stretch 4” to hit the outside shot, particularly the 3-point shot. I would not mind the Lakers trading Gasol and Duhon to Toronto for Andrea Bargnani and Jose Calderon.

Dan: I think it’d be a win for the Knicks with how healthy Amare has been as of late.

Joao: Even though Gasol is older, it seems like Amare is declining faster, based on what we saw last season. This season we haven’t seen Amare yet and Gasol is posting career lows in points, rebounds and shooting percentage, to name some stats.

But I like the trade for New York. Amare is more of a defense liability and I believe Pau still has something in his tank. Amare has been battered by injuries and his position in the Knicks’ starting 5 is in serious jeopardy now that Carmelo has shifted to PF. Gasol has enough reach to play minutes as SF and then change positions with Carmelo when and as required. On the other hand, Amare does have previous chemistry with Steve Nash. But it’s late 2012, Nash isn’t the player he used to be and I would see the Knicks having the upper hand with this trade.
 
EJ: As a New Yorker, who also happens to be a Lakers fan, I am more than familiar with this trade proposal. It’s something that has been suggested the second Mike D’Antoni landed in L.A. and is viewed on both sides, as a deal where one team trades a piece that doesn’t fit for the other. However, I absolutely hate this trade for the Lakers. Yes, Amare had success when he played for the Suns, executing the pick and roll with Steve Nash. The problem is Amare was the center for the Suns. In LA, he would be sharing the paint with Howard, and re-creating the same issues that he has now in New York with Chandler. What the Lakers need is a stretch four that is comfortable away from the basket, to knock down the open shot, and that guy is not Amare Stoudemire.

2. Pau Gasol. Jalen Rose says he will never work in the Lakers system, looking  at his minutes, do you think he’s right?

DJ: Been saying this for a while. Gasol is a center masquerading as a PF and it worked in the Triangle because he’s an excellent passer, but it’s time for him to move on. He isnt a very good fit at all in Mike’s offense and he just looks lost. They need to tradehim to a team that can play him at his natural position. A team like the Raptors.

Dan: What is Jalen Rose expecting from Gasol? Domination every single night? I think Gasol fits fine, actually.

Joao: I think he is probably right, but that isn’t the main issue. The main issue is that the system isn’t working. Pau Gasol is still one of the best PFs in the game, he has high-caliber championship and international experience. There is a reason why such a star studded team isn’t getting the wins they should; take your pick between:

– The system is broken
– Steve Nash needs to be at 100% for D’Antoni’s run ‘n gun system to work
– Players haven’t had the time yet to adjust to each other
Pau Gasol isn’t the problem. These 3 issues, or some of them, are.
 
EJ: My favorite member of the Fab Five is absolutely right. Jalen knows his stuff. Pau has been subbed out of games for Antawn Jamison. Think about that. Pau, who has two championship rings, is being subbed out of games by an older, less accomplished player. No knock on Jamison, but he shouldn’t have as large a role as he does now. Pau is comfortable away from the basket, but at this point in his career, he would be more effective playing in the low post. Asking Pau, a player that has a high basketball IQ, to be nothing more than just a jump shooter in the high post is just beyond him at this point. Moving Pau Gasol would not cure the Lakers problems, and he really isn’t the cause for their woeful start, but if anyone needs a change of scenery it would be Pau Gasol.
 
David’s Note: I hate Jalen Rose, but his podcast is exceptional.

3. Next trade

Artest/Gasol for Boozer/Deng

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7rjyw44

DJ: Again, it’s not the kind of trade they should be looking at. Boozer is a solid player and fits best as the 3rd option on offense, but the Lakers offense really needs a 3-point shooting power forward.

Dan: Have to say that trade favors the Lakers, but I wouldn’t recommend them to do it.

Joao: Interesting scenario. The Lakers seem keen on shipping Pau and Boozer’s future with the Bulls is uncertain.

I’ll give an edge to the Lakers with this trade. Boozer would be an interesting option alongside Dwight Howard and Luol Deng is arguably the best player of the 4 going forward.
I don’t think the Bulls would want Metta World Peace back and, quite frankly, even though he is having a better season than the last 2 or 3 ones, he isn’t capable of having the same type of overall contribution Deng has.
While the Bulls wouldn’t be unfairly losing with this trade, what would be the motivation of Gasol and World Peace in going to the windy city?
 
EJ: I’ve never been a Luol Deng fan. He’s effective but he doesn’t do anything that wow’s me. However, for the purpose of this question, I can see this deal happening. The Bulls seem interested in Gasol, and Mitch Kupchak has had interest in Luol in the past. Boozer is an interesting player. I’m not sure he’s the perfect fit, nor would he be my first choice for the Lakers (that would be Ryan Anderson on the Hornets) but Boozer is fairly athletic and has shown that he’s comfortable in the mid-range game. Not sure the Bulls would want Ron Artest, but I give this trade scenario a fair chance of actually happening.

4. Final LA Fake Trade

Gasol / Clark for Boozer / Hamilton

Could he be the Prize?

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=c4cf639

DJ: No.

Dan: Definitely favors the Lakers. Hate the trade for the Bulls.

Joao: Rip is having a better season than most expected and he would be a more than serviceable backup for Kobe, giving this team some much needed bench depth; plus he can hit free throws (Hello Dwight Howard!). He is the difference maker in this trade scenario.

Earl Clark is unproven and in the trade for salary considerations. And Gasol for Boozer gives some advantage for the Bulls but not early as much so as to offset the contribution of Rip Hamilton.

and just for kicks

EJ: Another Pau Gasol trade scenario? Yay! I just can’t contain my unbridled enthusiasm. Anyway, this is another Pau to the Bulls situation, and like the last proposal I give this deal a fair chance of happening. Rip Hamilton would be another grizzled veteran, and as long as he doesn’t tick Kobe off, he would be welcomed in the locker room. Earl Clark hasn’t done anything as a Laker and he likely won’t do anything as a Bull but he’s a valuable trade chip due to his affordable contract. Do I like this scenario? It’s OK…

5. Al Jefferson to the Bucks for Monte Ellis and Mike Dunleavy.

Dan: Definitely think that it would help the Bucks out down low as they’re missing a true big man, but I don’t think that they’d want to give up Dunleavy or Ellis to make that happen.

Joao: It is well documented by now that the Jazz have a talented frontcourt. Talented to the point that is is too talented, that they will have to eventually get rid of some of their 4 main frontcourt players. Al Jefferson, Paul Millsap, Enes Kanter and Derrick Favors. Al Jefferson is the present and Millsap and Kanter are the future. Plus it doesn’t hurt that Jefferson has an expiring contract, so ship him away.

It is obvious that what the Jazz need is backcourt talent. Monta Ellis would certainly fill that void, and Mo Williams would probably become his backup. And Mike Dunleavy is obviously not a pushover.
Even though I believe Al Jefferson is the best player of the 3 in this trade, this makes perfect sense for the Jazz. They reduce their crowded frontcourt while getting a high scoring guard and an above average small forward.
What about the Bucks? They instantly get an overall machine of an inside player, and they solve the problem of having two identical players on their backcourt, in Ellis and Jennings. The only problem is that Jennings’ contract is expiring and they might risk losing their entire backcourt in the process (sorry Udrih, I am not counting on you). And losing Dunleavy also hurts.
Slight edge to the Jazz.
 
EJ: Finally! A trade scenario I can fall in love with! This deal makes perfect sense for both teams. The Jazz have a bit of a log jam in the front court with Jefferson and Milsapp taking playing time away from Kanter and Favors. The Jazz also lack back court scoring since Alec Burks is looking like a bust at the shooting guard position. The Bucks have Mike Dunleavy taking minutes from John Henson and Tobias Harris. The Bucks also have a back court in Ellis and Jennings that doesn’t work. The players are too similar and one has to go. That’s why I love this scenario. It solves both teams issues, and opens up playing time for younger players. This needs to get done. A.S.A.P.

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2 Comments

  1. We cannot trade Gasol while he’s hurt, and you know we will get more than just Amare for him.

    How about the Mavs? After the Deadline, maybe we flip him for OJ and Elton Brand? Does that work?

  2. Salary wise it works but the Mavs don’t seem willing to take on long term salary.

    Good question though. Thanks for reading.

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